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-~~M t---- k _ iim ___ XtlcI xI MANNING, S. C., WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 30, 185NO14 CO0UNTY G 0 VE R N1 E NT. THE CONVENTION DISCUSSES THAT IMPORTANT MATTER. A Long and iuterestIng Deibate About the Nunmber of counties-What the Conven tion Did With the Article. COLUmBI. S. C., Oct. 22.-Special: The Constitutional Convention began this week with the consideration of a subject that has engaged much of the public attention, and which, in the convention itself, brought about one of the most animated and interesting debates of the session. After rapidly disposing of prelimi naries the convention, on motion of Mr. Otts, took up the report on coun ties and county government-the pa per which bears this peculiar title: "Report of G. D. Tillman, A. K. Smoak, J. W. Kennedy, J. 0. A. Moore, J. C. Otts and R. R. Stack house, whoconstitute the half of what was once the whole committe on coun ties and county government, and who have no chairman, no clerk, no pa pers, no resolutions and no name by which to designate their half of the committee," was read as follows: Sec. 1. The several counties of this State are each declared a body politic and corporate. Each county shall constitute one election district. Sec. 2. The boundaries of the sever al counties shall remain as now estab lished, except those of the county of Edgefield, which shall undergo such changes as are made necessary by the formation of a new county from a portion of Edgefield, to be known as baluda, the boundaries of which are set forth in a constitutional ordinance. Sec. 3. The general assembly shall have power at any time to organize new counties, by changing the bound aries of old ones, but no new counties shall be hereafter formed of less area than 400 square miles, nor shall any existing counties be reduced to less ex tent; provided, that no old county shall be reduced to less than 10,000 in habitants, as shown by the last State or national census, nor be reduced to less amount of taxable property than $1,500,000 as shown by the last tax re turns. Sec. 4. Whenever 300 freeholders within the area of a proposed new county shall petition for organization of a new county, the governor shall order an election within a reasonable time before the meeting of the next session of the legislature, and if a ma jority of the qualified electors voting in each part of the county or counties proposed to be dismembered and em in the new county shall sepa rately vote therefor, it shall be the duty of the legislature to established such new county at its next session; but elections as herein provided shall not be held in any proposed county -4ener than once in four years. Sec. 5. All counties formed ir ac cordance wtth the above sections shall assume an equitable portion of the debts of the existing county or coun ties from which its territory is taken. Sec. 6. The legislature may provide for the consolidation of two or more existing counties if a majority of the qualified electors of such counties vot ng at an election held for that pur pose shall vote separately therefor,but such elections shall not be held often er than once in four years in the same counties. Sec. 7. Each county shall elect a sheriff, a clerk of the court and a cor oner, whose respective terms of office shall be four years, and whose duties and powers shall be defined by law; provided the sheriff shall not be eligi ble to re-election until the expiration ofu ur years. 8e. . A chaingang shall be estab lished in every county in the State: provided that this section shall not prevent two or more counties from consolidating their respective chain Sec.9. Each of the several town ships of this State, with namhes and boundaries as now established by law, shall constitute a body politic; but this shall not prevent the legislature from organizing other townships. Sec. 10. The freehold voters of each township shall elect at such times and for such terms of office as may be pre scribed by law, three discreet persons, to be known as the board of township directors, who shall have charg~e of the township roads, bridges andY fer ries, the public schools, appoint the managers of all Federal, State, county and township elections, shall register all, qualified voters of the township andi shall discharge such other duties and receive such compensation for their services as the legislature may prescribe. Sec. 11. The general assembly may exempt any county from such town ship system of government whenever a majority of the freehold voters of the county shall petition therefor. Mr. Gary had moved to indefinitely postpone it, when the. president an nounced that Mr. Harrison's action in adding his name thereto had made it thelmajority report; therefore the other report was the minority report and must1 be considered first. THE 3HNORITY REPORT. Mr. Otts moved to indefinitely post pone the minority report. The article reported by the minority read as follows: Sec. 1. The legislature may from time to time establish new counties in the following manner: Whenever one-third of the qualified voters within the area of the proposed new county shall petition the gover nor for the creation of a new county the governor shall order an election within a reasonable time thereafter, by the qualified voters within the pro posed area, in which election they shall vote yes or no upon the question of creating said new county. Sec. 2.1If a majority of tlie qualified voters within the several sections pro posed to be fortged into a new county shall separately vote "ves" upon such question then the legislature shall es tablish such new county. Provided. that an election upon such question shall not be ordered upon the same proposed new county oftener than once in four years. Sec. 3. No county hereaf ter formed shall contain less than one hundred and twenty-fourth part of the whole number of the inhabitants of the State nor shall it have less assessed taxable property than two millions of dollars, nor shall it contain less than 400 squar miles. e. 4. No oud conmyt shall be r duce-d to less area than 500 square miles. to less assessed taxable property than 2.000.0i0. nor to smaller popu lation than 15,000o inhabiLanits Sec. 5 No new Countv liie shall be run nearer to an estatblisthed court house than 10 miles. lrovided, that this section shall not apply to court houses located in counties not pro posed to be dismembered. Sec. 6. All new counties hereafter formed shall bear a just apportion ment of the valid indebtedness of the old county or counties from which they have been formed. THE DEBATE. Mr. Gary took the floor and denied that he and those with him were op posed to smaller counties, as had been rumored about, but they did not want to see old counties destroyed. This is a matter of deep concern to my peo ple. An enlightened self-interest was the basis of good government. He wanted to tell them what the effect would be. He proceeded to tell how the proposed scheme to slice Abbeville county would leave that county-in the shape of a shoestring with the court house at one end. Why destroy Abbeville county? She had always re sponded to the call of her State in war and in peace. Is that an unreasonable request? He was not for saying any thing against new counties. Their re port simply put on limitations to al low new counties and there was noth ing to protect old counties. MNr. Otts was sorry that the friends of the minority report had confined their argument to only one section of the State. They all knew that if Greenwood and Honea Path counties were formed, the county of McCor mick would never be formed. He went on to tell the effect of establish ing Florence county wholly out of Darlington. They try to tell you that it co4S as much to run a small county as a large one. This is not so. He then gave the figures as to Abbeville and siowed that Florence's levy had been below Abbeville's. Florence had increased her taxable property. The main difference in the two reports was that the boundary line should not run within less than 10 miles of the court house. The geographical centre of a county was not the true centre. Look at RicIland. The real centre was that most convenient to all the people. There had been no complaint against Richland's county seat. Mr. McGowan thought better results would be obtained by taking up the majority report first. A POINT OF ORDER. Mr. George D. Tillman said that ac cording to all parliamentary rules the minority report should be tabled and then the majority report could be amended by the minority. The convention decided to take up the minority report. Sec. 1 was amended in a matter of phraseology only. Governor Sheppard offered the fol lowing as an amendment: "Provided. That the new counties shall not be created so as to increase the number of counties above 50-15 beyond those now existing." He urged that some limit was nec essary. Mr Brice of York opposed this pro viso, but took the position tat the di vision of an existing county should depend upon all conditions- area, population, wealth, etc. Senator Tillmnan moved to insert G2 instead of 50, and spoke in favor of such change. Mr. Johnstone opposed any mere numerical limit-though he thought 62 a good number. He wanted an equilibrium between the different sec tions of the State. He said with 50 ounties they could have 600 square miles to thecounty. If they adopted 550 square miles as the area limitation they would have 54 counties. If you can take 500 you will have 60 coun ties. 22 miles across and 11 miles from the court house to the boundary. If you have 450 square miles as the limit of the area you will have 67 counties If you have 400 square miles you will hae 70 counties with the centre 10 miles from the boundary- They should so arrange their schenme that, as the State developed, no one section could come forth and gobble up the control of legislation in the interest of that seetion. Now it is impossible to have the size of the counties identically the same, but they could protect the in terests of the old counties in the gen eral assembly. All interests could be given a reasonable protection if they adopted asaminimum limit 450 square miles and 550 square miles as the max im and as a matter of fact there would b only 100 square miles at the out side,and as a matter of fact this would be scarely more than fifty in any case. This would let you reach the same figure practically as proposed by Sen ator Tillman, not by an arbitrary fig ure, but by reason and by a plan pre serving an equality to the people of all sections of the State. You might go further and have the requirement that the people of the county could not have a new county except on certain onditions. Mr. George D. Tillman was the next speaker. It was a subject near to his heart and he made a masterly speech, commanding the closest attention of the entire convention. He said he had never risen feeling more unable to do justice to a cause or to himself. If he a not had this smaller county mat ter at heart lie never would have been a member of the convention. He told why he had come and how his people had insisted on sending him. He had no aeto grind; no end to attain; he was done with public office; he was done with that forever. His public ca reer was behind him. New lights were rising in politics. Men were always for the rising, not for the setting sun. He was not conscious of any mental decay, however. Therefore they could understand that he was here advocat ing this measure with the purest mo tives. More good would come from this measure than from the regulation of the suffrage. They did not want to let this settle itself. Thirty-four thous and square miles was the accepted and settled area of the State. If you limit the new counties to 50, you will give 68 miles as the ai-ea, which is more than the present Constitution allowed a county to have. We have an aver age area of something over 1.000 square miles. My friend says Georgia had to put on a limit after she had 132 counties established. I challenge any member on their floor to cite to me a single instance where any county in any State once formed has asked to be consolidated with another. It was a sinular- fact that for the lirst 00 years aftr South Carolina was !irst settled, we had but a single courthouse and that was in Charleston. The p~eople had to go down there to get justice ad ministered. There were no railroads. turs and lynch law in self-defense. It was due to this fact that the ancestor of Mr. Thomas Woodward, of Fair field. was assassinated on the road. The long travel to the courthouse, 30 miles away, was the trouble-the dan ger in having large counties. That should be fixed differently. Such trips were expensive to the people. The people must make laws to gov ern themselves. They must do it through representatives. Why not elect every body by a vote of the State if you are going to have these "big, great" counties-60 or 70 miles across -to elect them as now, is but little better. If you want the people to get the best men let those men be elected by the people who reside in a small territory in which all live, and all the people know him. The representa tives of a large county are not careful of going against the will of their con stituents like those of a small county. He thought the New England people were better and more wisely governed than any people on this earth, and he attributed it to their townsnip system of government. It was a close con stituency and representation. The people knew the men. He might enumerate many advantages of the smaller counties. If it was desirable to 'have large judicial districts, why have but one? Is it right, wise, pro per-is it liberty to have every man to go to the expense of attending court till all other people's cases are tried? And, let me say, no other State but South Carolina requires it. Just look at the Cost to the people. Our coun ties average nearly 1,000 square. He bore no bitterness to the old city by the sea. He did, however, during his early manhood, because of her parish system, which caused her to control thinos pretty much her own way. He had ?ed the the fight against and de stroyed the system in the 1865 conven tion. South Carolina was originally set tled on the coast and at one time had only six counties-Beaufort, Colleton, Charleston, Barnwell, Sumter and Or angeburg, and had 26 senators out of that body's members, and until the close of war,and Charleston had ten of them. The up-country then had more than four times the population and paid the bulk of the taxes. It seems like poetic justice that the low-count should experience a little of this equ - ity now. There is not a large county in the State that would be willing to see one foot cut off of its territory, if left to it. The greatest exhibition of meanness he had ever seen was when the question of reducing the area was present to the people, the newest coun ties voted against it. Indeed enlight ened self-interest was the best, but some people were so little and so mean that they couldn't come up to that standard, and so he would say that his friend from Abbeville should work up to that objective-enlightened-before using it. (Laughter.) Georgia's average county acreage was 423 square miles; Tennessee was 427, with a provision pending to make it 385; Kentucky's was 318; Virginia's 383; none of the counties in those States wanted to consolidate with any other county. They held on to their counties, to use a vulgar expression, "like death to a dead nigger." All there is in it is to allow the people to govern themselves. Give the people a chance, in God's name-a chance which they never have had before. Therefore. he contended to allow any section 'willing to erect its build ings and pay its expensesto form itself into a new county. He said the ma jority report had~ thrown certain re strictions around the methods of form ing a new county. The other report was fatally defective in all essential particulars. He would; therefore move to substitute the section of the majority report on the subject for the section of the minority report. The parliamentary methods being employ ed in this matter was new to him. He was continuing his argument when the hour for recess arrived. At the night session Col. Tillman concluded his speeh, emphasizing the points he has alredy made. Mr. W. C. McGowan then took the floor and made an able speech. He said he confessed to some interest in the matter, as he was proud of and loved old Abbeville, now menaced on all sides by at least six new county schemes, all wanting to take parts of her territory. He said he did not think Mr. Tillman's arguments were borne out by the facts. There were now a great many conditions which he pro ceeded to speak of. He supposed his venerable friend, for whom he had the highest respect, but whom he be lieved was flying off at a tangent now, was as much interested in getting Mc Cormick county as he was in having Abbeville as she was. Mr. George Tillman stated that he lived 20 miles from the proposed seat of McCormick county, and had a rail road to get there, it was true, but he had no interest in the county seat of the prosposed county. Mr. McGowan-But you are an earn est advocate of it? Mr. Tillman-No, sir. Mr. McGown-Well, you are in favor of it. Mr. Tillman-I would vote for it. There was further colloquy betwveen Mr. McGowan and Mr. Talbert. Mr. McGowan presented a letter from Maj. Win. T. Gary. This letter said: "The small counties of Georgia have not been a benefit ;" that the ex penses of goverenment had been in creased; that the offices yielded but oor pay; that good officers could not esecured. He also read a letter from Maj. Hammond of Atlanta, which was along the same line. Mr. McGowan then devoted himself to the discussion of the ten mile limit matter. He thought this limit was just. They spoke of Columbia being right on the bank of the Congree. This was really the best argument on his side. Suppose the limit was not placed there, couldn't theline of a new county be run up to Columbia's eas tern boundary and make Richland county a little strip. This ten mile limit was in the original law of the following State: Arkansas, Illinois, Kentuck,Missouri,Pennslyvania and Texas. ie wanted this limit to pro tect his county scat, he was free to confess. Senator Tillman spoke earnestly in favor of his amendment, Messrs. Mc Gowan and George Johnstone spoke on the other side. The president then put the Tillman amendment while Mr. McCalla was velling out a motion to adjourn. It as declared killed a division was de manded. Great confussion ensued, and while it continued the unfavorable report of the committee of having the president of the convention appoint a successor toth lnat 1Drn. Byrd wase adopted. Then another division vote on the new county matter was taken, result ing in the proposed "62 limit" being killed by a vote of 80 to "no further count demanded." The Convention then adjourned till this morning. FURTHER DISCUSSION. When the Covention met this morn ing, there was no time lost in resum ing the consideration of the matter pending-the article on counties and county government. The first section which had been un der consideration all of the previous day was again called up. Mr. Ira B. Jones renewed the mo tion made by Mr. Talbert the night be fore to table the minority and take up the ma'ority report first. Mr. . B. Gary said that this propo sition was a serious matter; there were matters in this report which should be considered as they stood. To pass Mr. Jones' motion would be to reverse the action of the convention already taken. It was merely a new scheme to dispose of the minority report. He moved to table Mr. Jones' motion. This was carried by a vote of 63 to 52. Mr. Prince then offered an amend ment to strike out the word "qualified" before the word"voters"and say "free holder" instead. I move t ay this amendment on the table By a vote of 63 to 56 the amendment was tabled. Mr. Buist offered an amendment to section 1 to strike out the word "legis lature" on line 1 and insert "general assembly." This was adopted. Mr. Gage offered this amendment which was adopted: Amend by add ing of line 7 after the word "county" the following words: "And at the same election the question of a name and a county seat for such county shall be submitted to the electors." Mr. John B. Jones offered to substi tute section 4 of the majority report for section 1 as amended. This motion had beeu made out of order by Mr. G. D. Tillman the night before. Mr. B. R. Tillman moved to table, but withdrew to allow Mr. G. D. Till man to speak. Mr. Tillman said he wanted make a few remarks in reply to Mr. McGown's speech last night. He gave some strong statements in regard to the rea son why the term "pauper" counties had been applied to certain counties in Kentucky, quite different from what the convention had understood. He merely rose, he said, to take the sting out of his frined's "pauper coun ty" argument. His young friend had made statements that he should be ashamed of. MR. OTTS ON ROSTATION. Mr. Otts said, in this State ople seldom "rotated," Edgefield, the old monopolistic county, had dominated the second district, and she had con trolled the State offices for years. Senator Tillman-Whv don't you speak to the question? Mr. Otts-The gentleman from Edgefield does not always speak to the question. He has set me the example. (Laughter.) Mr. Johnson of Sparntanburg op posed the substitute. Mr. Burn sopke in favor of a minimum area of 500 square miles. Mr. McGowan stated that he did not do or say things that he was ashamed of. He thouit his friend from Edge field was unjustified in such a position. Then he quoted what Governor Brown f Georgia had said in the Constitu tional convention which put a stop to the formation of counties in Georgia: "There is a considerable number of ounties in this State now, I believe about 137. There are a number of tem that do not pay as much money into the State treasury of the State as hey draw out. They do not pay a ollar of the public debt, nor the ex enses of the government, nor even as uch money as the government is ompelled to pay out on their account. This matter of making up counties has one far enough." There was a spat between Messrs. G. D. Tillman and McGown, outof which either seemed to make much. Mr. Tilman said he would like to hear of an two counties anywhere that ever akdto be consolidated into one when one formed. Mr. D. S. Henderson asked Senator Tillman if there was any way by which :ounties could consolidate. Mr. Tillman--Yes, sir. Mr. Henderson-Where? Mr. Tillman-In the Mississippi, in he Georgia and other Constitutions, nd I defy you to find an instance where any county ever asked for a onsolidation. Mr. Patterson then stated that this onvention had expressed itself in this atter pretty fully and he thought this substitute should be tabled. There was no use to put in this new matter. They had already amended the section to suit. The substitute offered by Mr. Jones was then killed . O ~aUH HOW IT GTT~CH Section 1 was then adopted as a whole in the following shape: Section 1. The general asssembly may, from time to time, establish new ounties in the following manner: Whenever one-third of the qualified voters within the area each section of n old county proposed to be cut off to form a new county shall petition the governor for the creation of a new ounty, setting forth the boundaries d having complied with the require ments of this article, the governor shall order an election, withmn a rea sonable time thereafter, by the quali fied voters within the proposed area, in which election they shall vote "yes"~ or "no" upon the question of reating said new county, and at the same election the question of a name nd a couty seat for such county shall be submitted to the electors. SECTION Two. Section 2 was then taken up, read ing thus: Sec. 2. If a majority of the qualified vters within the several sections pro posed to be formed into a new county shall separatelv vote "yes" upon such question then the legislature shall es tablish such new county; provided. that an election upon such question shall not be ordered oftener than once in four years. Mr. McGowan offered to amend by striking out the word "majority" in the first line and inserting "two-thirds.'' He gave his reasons for this, saying that he had found this provision in nearly every Constitution. Mr. Otts said it was undemocratic ui lie moved to table, demanding the roll call on this motion. It resulted as follows, the convention refusing to table: Yeas 58, nays 78. Having refused to table Mr. Mc Gowan's amendment, Mr. Otts moved to substitute fcur-fifths, which was The McGowan amendment was then laoted. The Convention was very prompt yesterday morning in taking hold of the pending business-the article on counties and county government. The matter pending was Senator Till man's amendment to make the taxa ble property in any proposed new county one and one-half million, which was an amendment to Mr. Prince's amendment to make it three million, the committee's report recom mending two million. This was the matter under discussion the previous day. Mr. Parler, favored this amendment whilst Messrs. Howell and Behre op posed it. There was quite a lively hit between the former and Senator Till man. Mr. Talbert said all these matters should be left to the Legislature, with due consideration for the will of the people and their convenience. Mr. Jeremiah Smith of Ho1ry fav ored new counties, but thought there should be limitations. Mr. D. S. Henderson then called the previous question on the amendment of Senator Tillman. Senator Tillman said he was willing to let the matter come to a vote. He did not care to have any more talk about it. Mr. Prince said that when he offer ed his three million dollar amend ment he did not know all that had been brought out in the debate. He wished to say that if Senator Tillman's amendment vas tabled he would with draw his and let the committee's re commendation of two million stand. Mr. Bellinger moved to table the Tillman amendment. which was done on a division vote of 74 to 67. A CHANGE 01' HEART. Senator Tillman insisted on having the roll call on this matter, and it was allowed, resulting in a vote directly the opposite, the convention refusing to table-thus by a vote of 76 nays to 68 yeas. The amendments offered by Senator Tillman and Mr. Pzince were then adopted. Mr. W. B. Wilson offered this amendment: "Resolved, That when there is em braced within the limit of the propos ed new county a city having the pop ulation of 5,000 inhabitants or more, then such new county shall be formed with an area of not less than 300 square miles." Mr. J. S. Brice moved to table. Before this could be put, Mr. Rags dale got the floor and stated that un less something like this was done, Rock Hill would become the county seat of York county any way. It would vote itself so in the course of time. The amendment was tabled by a vote of 81 to -"no further count de. manded." Mr. E. J. Kennedy moved to amend by making the minimum territory 500 instead of 400 square miles. Lost nays 92, yeas 53. Mr. McWhite moved to make the limit 450 square m:es. Lost-nays 74, yeas G9. Mr. George Johnstone offered an amendment to make it 550 square miles, but withdrew it after some talk had been indulged in. Section 3 was then adoptcd as a whole as follows: SECTIoN 3. No new county bereaf ter formed shall contain less than one sixteenth part of the whole number of the inhabitants of the State, nor shall it have less assessed taxaole property than one and one-ha.f millions of dol lars as shown by the last tax return. nor shall it contain less area than 400 square miles. Section 2 was ther. taken up in its razy-quilt shape. Several amend ments being forthcoming, it was found that it was so patched up already that it could not be straightened by amend ment. Consequenil y the section was passed over to be taken up at the ight session. SECTION FOUR was then called up and read as fol ows; SECTIoN 1. No old county shall be rduced to less area than 500 square iles, to less taxable property than 2,000,000, nor to a smaller population han 15,000 inhabitants. Mr. Johnstone moved to amend so s to make old counties certain to have t least 550 square miles. He said his was a safe figure and would pre erve the status of these counties in he house and senate. Senator Tillmnan saidl that he did ot want too much discrimination in favor of old counties. Mr. Prince moved tc table. This reailed by a vote of 67 to 44. The section was then adopted as it tood. SECTION FIVE. Mr. Patterson tried to have section 5 passed over until S p. in., as it was ate in the day and was a very impor ant matter they were about to take p. The convention declined to do his. Mr. W. D. Evans stated that if the entlemen desired to attend the circus, e move that he be excused. The president rushed this sugges ion through as a motion, and the auo-h was on Mr. Patterson. T~ie section was then taken up read ng thus. SEc. 5. No new county lines shall e run nearer to an estab'lished court ouse than 10 miles: Provided that his section shall not apply to court ouses located in counties not propos d to be dismembered. Mr. Talbert moved to strike out the ection. Mr. Connor moved to add except when such lines are natural barrier o trade. Mr. McCalla spoke at some .length n the subject of new counties in gen ral. His opinions had been formed rom experience. He knew a great eal about Georgia. Adopt Georgia's scheme and y ou will bring ruin and expense on the State. He was at the same time for the reduction of the rea to 500 for old counties. Give the ld counties ample and just protection Ee wanted justice for every old coun y seat in the State. What man ould like to see his old county dis antled. Don't leave it to the people s they will tell you to do. There's oo much self-interest ini the matter or that, lie wanted them to consid r this matter seriously, lie wanted hem to take care of the old county eats. Mr. Patterson made some pleasant eferences to the circus, and said there ere doubtless a good miany there who ould like to be excused now, a-s only 10 minutes more time remained, lie herefore moved to take a recess till 8 >. in. Mr. Breazeal had this changed to 7:30 p. in., and the recess was taken. In the afternoon a large number of the delegates attended the circus. TilE NIc;HT SESSTQN. Slenator Tillman moved to strike out the word "sections" at the end of the first line and insert instead the words "townships or parts of townships." Adopted. Mr. J. S. Brice then offered this pro viso to go at the end of the section, which was rejected: "Provided fur ther that the general assembly may alter or change the the lines of any proposed county or may refuse to es tablish the same." Mr. Ira B. Jones offered an amend. ment to strike out the word "voters" in line 1 and insert "electors voting in sa.d election." Mr. McGowan could not see where ary good could come from such an amendment. He moved to lay on the table, but withdrew. I he amenment was adopted. Mr. McGowan then offered, amid much opposition, to amend by insert ing the words "and one-third of the qualified voters in the remaining por tion of the counties affected thereby," after the word "county" on line 2. Mr. Johnstone moved to table, and Mr. McGowan thereupon withdrew. The section was then read as amend ed for the information of the conven tion. Mr. Prince offered an amendment to insert just before the proviso in the section as reported, the following: "Provided, the precedent provisions of this article have been complied with." This was adopted. On the suggestion of Senator Till man the section was passed over for the present. SECTION THREE. When section 3 was taken up, Mr. E. J. Kennedy offered to amend by strik ing out the words "one hundred and twenty-fourth," and inserting "sixti eth." The effect, he said. would be to give at least two members in the house and one in the senate for each county. Mr. Patterson moved to lay the amendment on the table, and on that call for the ayes and nays. The vote was: Yeas 88, nays 51. So the amend ment was tabled. Mr. W. B. Wilson then moved to strike out the provision for the 400 square mile limit. He spoke in favor of the motion. The amenment was, on motion of Mr. Brice of York, tabled. Senator Tillman, in referring to the peculiar way the extremes on both sides were fighting, working into one another's hands, made use of the phrase '-damnable combination"' likening it to the unholy alliance of the barkeep ers and the prohibitionists to fight the dispensary law. Mr. Ira B. Jones-You are using improper language here. Tiilman-If I am tread.ing on any body's toes all right; I am sorry. Mr. Jones-You are not treading on my toes; you are insulting this con vention by talking of a combination. After a few more remarks Senator Tillman took his seat after explaining his words. Section 3 was then adopted. SECTION FOUR. Mr. Prince then offered to amend section 4 by striking out "two" before "million" in the second line and insert ing instead "three." Thesection as amended read: Section 4. No -old county shall be reduced to less area than 500 square miles, to less taxable property than two million dollars, nor to a smaller population than 15,000 inhabitants. This proposed three million dollars' limitation was opposed by Senator Tillman. He moved to substitute by saying one and one-half millions. With such a provision as had been proposed the new county of Saluda could never have been established. Gen. Hemphill said that everybody seeemed to have it all down wrong. They talked as if all were in favor of the small county idea, as if the salva tion of the State depended on dividing her up. He was opposed to any divis ion. That this State was not in better shape than Georgia, so far as taxes was concerned, was a misstatement. He cited Atlanta's condition. He did not charge any man here with being actuuated by any unjustmotive. They were all there with the best motives to adopt measures for the best inter ests of the people. When the city of Columbia advertises herself as a win ter resort does she say she has a court house. No she says she has a fine cli mate, factories, good water, etc. Mr. Patterson-A point of order. The gentleman says Columbia has good water. (Laughter.) Gen. Hemphill was drinking a glass of it when the interruption came and seemed to like it. Then he cited the advantages Abbe vile would present- He cite also the matter of the troubles to be encoun tered by new counties. The taxable property of Georgia had fallen off $52,000,000. That was the argument he presented. It was not necessary to have new countiesi n order to prosper. He was satisfied to let well enough alone. Mr. W. D. Evans moved ta postpone the further consideration of this mat ter till 10 o'clock this morning. This was agreed to. A MARK OF RSPECT. Mr. Evans then offered the follow ing resolutions which were unani mously adopted. Whereas, a member of this conven ;ion, the Hon. R. F. Hodges, died at his home in Bennettsville, S. C., at 5 o'cock this 22d day of October, 1895, and whereas we as a body have learned to value and appreciate his worth as a man and a member; therefore be it Resolved, first, That we can but bow to the will of Him who doeth all things well, yet it is hard to under stand why one so full of vigor, both of mind and body, in the prime of life, should be so suddenly called from a useful and honorable career. Second. That in his death this con vention has lost a useful member, the State a valued citizen and the county of Marlboro an able repre sentative and faithful ollicial. Third, That we will morun his de parture, cherish his money and emu late his virtues. Fourth, That a page of the journal of this convention be dedicated to his memory. Fifth) That a copy of these resolu tions, suitably engrossed, be forwarded by the secretary to his family.. As a further mark of respect to his memory I now move that these resolu tios oe made a special order for Thursday next at 12 im, and that this convention do now adjourn for the day. A CAUCUS P'RoPOSED. Mr. Tal bert, as the president wvas about to declare the body adjourned for the day, asked that the announce ment be nmade that there would be a conference of the Democratic mem bers of the convention in the hall at 7:30p. m. COrMHI Octtnir 24.-Special: at 7:30 p. m. the discussion came on Mr. Connor's amendment to make the limit 10 miles, unless it was a natural barrier to business . I Mr. Priitce offered the following, substitute: "In the formation of new coun ties no old county shall be cut within 10 miles of its county seat." There was further debate on this mo tion. Mr. Connor, after having served as county commissioner, had been thor oughly convinced of the necessity of smaller counties. The new system of county government had not been suf ficiently tested to make it plain wheth er the difficulties in the old counties had been overcome, and they should go slow until that was understood. The demand for smalleer counties was not from the people, but from ambi tious towns. lie favored a limit of some kind, but was not particular about its being 10 miles. If this new county scheme goes through unre stricted, there will be a race between the low and up-country for the con trol of the senate, and in 10 years the senate chamber will have to be en larged. He hoped his substitute would prevail. Mr. Bellinger would have to either vote for the original section or for Mr. Price's substitute for Mr. Connor's substitute. He spoke 6f the difference between "natural boundaries' as they are considered in the different parts of the State. In the low-country what is called a branch would be a river in the up-country.. There was a stream flowing within two miles of Barnwell court house only a foot or two wide, but it would have to become a 'natu ral boundary" if Mr. Connor's amend ment passed. There were delegations from 20 counties pledged not to dis member their counties, while but a half dozen might have come to cut their counties up. He believed in small counties, but was opposed to ruining the old counties There were in his immediate section Allendale, Denmark, Branchville and another wishing to become county seats and cut slices from Barnwell, Hampton and Colleton. Without this 10-mile limit they would be ruined. Senator Tillman opposed the ten mile limit, and moved to recommit the whole matter, and let the commit tee try to adjust the differences agree ing to disagree. Let them, be in structed to simply fix the minimum area for a county and leave the legis lature to use its judgment in settling the matter. A Member-Is not the gentleman like the man who was down and said he was whipped and then jumped up when turned loose and went fighting again? Mr. Tillhnan shouted something about his being for the interes, of the people. There was great con fusion, three or four men shouting at once, and a loud statement with violent gesticulatory accompaniment, of Mr. G. D. Tillman to his brother, was lost in the turmoil. Senator Tillman, after the presi dent's rapping the body to order, con tinued his remarks, closing by declar ing that this convention seemed to think that the people at home would vote on this question like asses and slaves instead of like freemen. MR. GARY REPLIES. Mr. Gary said that this was but another of Senator Tillman's 1lank movements, Senator Tillman was at once on his feet again, and Mr. Otts was up. Confusion reigned through out the hall. Mr. Tillman renewed his motion. Mr. Patterson then got the floor and said that he had waited for this fight to come on the 10 mile limit matter. His old county was vitally concerned in this 10 mile limit matter. He was afraid that his friend from Edgefield felt that he was whipped, and now wanted to recommit. Senator Tillman said he was not whipped, but the people would be whip ped. Mr. Patterson stated that he wanted to:say a few words for Barnwell. He and her people could not follow the gentleman from Edgefield. He was g'oing ahead, when Senator Tillman ask~ed him if there was not a distance of at least 30- miles between every court house in this State. Mr. Stokes made the point of order that on a motion to recommit no member could discuss the merits of any other question than that peniding. The chair sustained the point. Mr. Patterson-But the chair in dulgedme. The president stated that he had done so.but when a member raised the point he had to sustain it. Mr.- Patterson went on to enumerate the several schemes that were being worked by Allendale and other sec-. tions to make new counties. He only asked that they be protected in their old county rights. They had their money invested there. If you ado pt a 10 mile limit you will protect us. It was nothing but right for the old county men to defend their counties. They now had a fine system of public roads in their county, anil there was really no need of a new county. Mr. ID. S. Henderson simply wished to know whether this body would stul tify itself by recommitting the article. If they were going to instruct a com mittee, why not b~y all means settle it on the floor like men. Quit this useless waste of the people's time and money. He moved to lay the motion of Sena tor Tillman on the table. Hie withdrew this, and a straight vote was taken, resulting as follows yeas 17, nays 124. Mr . Cooper then moved to table Mr. 1 Prince's amendment. Lost-nays 70, yeas 68. ~Senator Irby, who had, it seemed, stepued outside the door after the vote found it closed on him, when the poll was taken.- When he came in he de manded to know by what rule the president was authorized to close the door against members during the tak ing of a vote. The president told him of the rule goverring the taking of aye and nay votes, but there was nothing clear on the subject in the rule. After some talk Senator Irby remarked: " Well, I give notice that I will niot be barred I out of this house by any one ." Mr. George D. Tillman moved to I ament. tme amendment by inserting ~ "7" for "10", and stated that lhe want- C ed the roll call on this amendment. Mr. Klugh moved to table. Mr-. Tillmian wa~s still on the floor. I e said: "I would like to know how the sn:.art parliamentarian fromi Abbe- ~ ville is so anxious to put me off the floor. Mr. Klugh explained. Mr-. Tillman said he accepted it; he nderstood very thoroughly that it as in accord with Abbeville's poicy L oNTINUED ON PAGE FOURJ.j s THE PEOPLE'S CARNIVAL. THE COMING STATE FAIR WILL BE A GREAT SUCCESS. Secretary Holloway Expresses Great Satis faction with the Outlook-The Entries Already Coming In-New Features. COLUMBIA, S. C., Oct. 26.-Special: The active work of those in charge of the arrangements or the coming fair of the Stte Agricultural and Mechani cal Cociety is sure to bear good fruit, not only in finer and fuller exhibits but in large crowds to see and enjoy them. The purpose of the manage ment to have a good fair is fully re cognized by the people of South Caro lina, and they are co-operating to an extent which:is very gratifying. Con ditions now are altogether dfferent from those which so injuriously affect ed the fair last year. The crops are better-the spirits of the people are better. The whole outlook, whether for farmer or merchant or manufac turer, is altogether brighter than it has been in the past three years. This the people are not only in better mood to look a little after recreation and pleasure, but they are more alive to the benefits which attendance on the fair must surely bring. They are com ing to Columbia for the fair. The low rate of one cent a mile for the round trip makes, it very cheap, and lots of people who have been con straiied to stay at home for the past year or two are coming along this time. The schedules, too, will be so arranged as to extend the best possible opportunities to people all along the lines. Accommodations in Columbia will be better than ever. A good sign just nowis the fact that the entries are coming in very satisfac torily. Col. Holloway, the secretary of the Society, is altooether pleased with the indications in thiis respect. In the course of a talk with a representa tive of the State newspaper, he said that the entries are coming in well, and in a few days the work of making entries will be in full blast. The first entries of consequence were made by that veteran farmer and stock raiser, Col. J. Wash Watts of Laurens county. "What is the outtook as to the at tendance of visitors?" -The low rates offered by the rail roads will induce a very large attend ance, especially from several sections of the State I have heard from." "I notice the orounds and buildings are to be open at night. What are the reasons therefor?" "Simply to allow the hundreds of lerks and other employees of the city an opportunity to attend the fair, and to offer those who desire it an oppor tunity to enjoy themselves dancig ltc. The second story of the old build ing will be given the young people to enjoy themselves in this year. It is Eoped those who engage in this inno :ent diversion will see that suitable rnusic is engaged for Tuesday Wednes lay and Thursday evenings. I might add that arrangements being made for firstelass attractions for fair week." There are those who thinks that the Atlanta Exposition will hurt our fair. From all that can be gathered on this subject, there is little if any ground ror any such apprehension. Many people from South Carolina will of :ourse attend the great exhibition in the Gate City. But these same peple will take in our fair as well. Tous mnds of others, who have no idea of going to Atlanta may be counted on to come to Columbia during fair week. A. large section of the State will be fully represented at the fair, whose people will scarcely be seen about At tanta. There is ,something jolly-some thmgo inspiring-about a big crowd of people, all bents on the one object of iaving a good time. The assurance f a fine attendance on our fair will pring numbers of people from all over south Carolina. * Not the beast of the attractions during 'air week is the theatre. For this time nanager Eugene Cramer has arranged i. fine selection of performances. All in all, the promise of a good air--good in every particular is strong pr every day as the time for the open Lng approaches. The fair opens on the 11th Novem der. Drowned LikePuppi.s. LoNDoN, Oct. 24.--The Standard will tomorrow publish a dispatch from Donstantinople confirming the reports >f the summary disposal of many of he young Turkish party, who were irrested on the charge of seditious prac ;ices. After trial they were conveyed tt night to the beach and thence to a arship. The boats of this warship hen took the prisoners to the place in ~he Bosphorus where the current runs .he strongest, and they were then hropped overboard. The dispatch also :onfirms the reports that the severe neasures taken by the porte has broken ;he spirit of the revolutionists. Hassan Pasha, the minister of marine, is inder suspicion and he is kept under ~lose surveillance at his residence at )rtakeni. The Water Famine. KixowooD, W. Va., Oct. 25.-The WVest Virginia Northern railroad has tbandonedall trains but one a day be ~ause water cannot be procud for ocomotives. The water famine in this ection of the State has become alarm ng. In order to make one train a day he railroad takes one of the locomo ives twenty miles; east on the Balti nore and Ohio to procure water. Wells tre nearly all dry here and creeks and prings have been dry for weeks. Cheat and Monongahela rivers can e waded by children at any point. 3oats cannot reach Morgantown, and dll the city has is slack water. Q2uickly Convicted. AUUiEVILL.E, S. C., O.ct. 22.-The use of the State against Tom Peterson or the murder of~Constable Moseley, ~egan last Saturday and was conclud d last night, the jury rendering a erdict of "'guilty.'' The case was otl contested by defendant's coun el. 1'he speeches for thedefense by]D. 1. Magill anid Ellis G. Graydon, were miong the ablest ever heard in this ourt house. Three Killed. EArT RADFORD, XA., Oct. 23.-A ast through freight on the Norfolk nd Western Railroad was wrecked by herd of ecattle, three miles West of falison at 3 o'clock this morning. ngineer U'Neill, Fireman C. P. 4indamood and Front Brakeman Ed fouseton, all of Bristol, Tenn., were astantly killed. Conductor Lewis loore anud t wo other brakemen were wriouslr injuind.